Wow! I am exhausted just reading all of these posts. Some of you may know me, and some might not, but I have been on this forum as a new small business for a year now, if not longer. I have not paid a cent for any of the advice that I have received, and have been helped many times out of difficult places that I have been in.

Most of us can possibly agree that to run something like this takes time and money, and I can bet that most of us would not be volunteering to do it.
So many organizations have workers, and critics (doing nothing).

If some of you do not want to join, simply don't do it. David is only asking that you do. He is trying to introduce something to all of us that he believes in, and asking for money in return. If you have a problem with it, then by all means go somewhere else.
None of us like to part with hard earned money, but if it is in the best interest of our business then it is money well spent. I do agree that most of us have given and taken advice for nothing, and it was very much appreciated, but that said, where do you get anything for nothing today.

All he is asking is that you give it a try. Even for a month, to see if it is something that you would want to go further with. Most Newbies are hungry for information and are thinking of taking their businesses to a higher level. If they see this as a helpful tool to make that happen, then I personally think they would do it. If it wasn't what they expected, then they can cancel it.

Give these Moderators some credit. They aren't going to put everything out there to everyone right now, especially with someone already putting up another forum. (I am also a member of sawmill creek), and will probably be joining this new one also. I want to get the most out of all of the forums out there. (To help my business out) Not to hurt anyone.

If I choose to pay for one, then I will. If I do not like it, I can quit. That is what has been proposed and that is what is going to take place. Some will like it, some will not. That's life.

I am going to join. I will say, that if it gets clicky or uninformative, then I will not continue, but so far, I love it and plan to stay with it.

Barbara :D 

Barbara , tis contibutors to the forum that give the info , not the forum itself
Essentially you are telling us the forum is of value to info leechers , but what value is it to info givers?

I think you misunderstood my post. I was talking only about lurkers not everyday helpers.

Cherie

Some of the suggestions have been in the works for months. They took some time away from the improvements.

Nothing has been said about what will remain free. A lot of that depends on what can be done programing wise. (That also is a bit still in limbo until we know the programing problems. But there will be at least some free.) Tune in after the subscription forum starts and you will see what we could come up with.

One of the reasons we have not announced what additional things will be, is most are still in the works, and until they are ready to go online they are vaporware. We will not announce vaporware.

The logos were announced because at least the preliminary setup is done. When we get a chance that will be prettied up and made a bit easier to use. That may be down the road a bit because we want to put the time into more meat first, then we can go with fluff.

I understand that something that has been available for free that now costs money can feel like you are being ripped off, but it is not so.

Philadelphia, PA (Really Bensalem)

Harvey's Tips Page When you finally understand it completely... it changes.

I personally think that a log should be kept of all of the members who have proclaimed their intention to move on and, more importantly, start a new forum that unoriginally mutates the name of this forum because of the price, and when they rejoin this forum because of the things they are missing out on, make them pay a penalty fee.
Talk is cheap. I understand those who feel that they will move on, but to make such issue with it and brag about how much they have contributed as if this site will totally shut down if it were not for them, and make "threats" and shameless self promotions of starting new forums with unoriginal names (which makes me wonder about the originality of their engraving abilities and ideas) makes them look like children. As David said, it is a sole proprietary; my business is my business and I will not have a supplier telling me how to run my business and likewise David should not allow any one member (or two, or three, etc.) to tell him how to run his site.
I honestly can see it now. A new forum will be started, the first two months or so will be primarily threads on how this forum sucks. By the 8th or 9th month the new free forum owner will find that there site is losing them some major capital to keep it running and within a year, the new forum will shut down, or it will advertise and start catering to suppliers, members will get ripped off by suppliers and start looking for forums that are not biased, so that within two years, many of the members will be back on this site enjoying professional advice and the owner of the new forum will be coming in under a new identity and causing sour grapes (again).
All of this is hypothetical, but to those who have the real problem with this there is some underlying reason that you are being so vocal about it. You know how the moderators feel, they know how you feel, if there is a problem then go ahead and leave and start your new forum. Those of us that believe in the importance of helping eachother out will be glad to hang out with you when you come to the conventions and brag about how much we are getting from our new controlled forum.
Though I am just starting in the engraving, I have already had an idea stolen from me. I look forward to the pay site because there will be a less likely chance of someone lurking for the purpose of building their business solely on the ideas of others (kind of like creating a forum that is copied from this one down to the name). I know that I will be more likely to share ideas and such with others that I know will use my ideas as a springboard for their own creative abilities rather than steal an exact idea.

You are telling us to ante up when we have no idea of what we're anteing up for cos you arent gonna announce vapourware - what do you think a $99 a year forum without any indication of what one is going to get is? Vapourware to the extreme.!!!! Why did you guys even open your mouths about it in the first place?
You guys are winging it as you go cos your pie in the sky idea is being shot down in flames.

Franklin , there are info leechers and info givers - do you honestly think that the givers are worried about not getting a share of the pie - when that info was given not one of them expected payment!!!
What the givers dont like is the fact that the info was submitted in the spirit of sharing and is now being used for commercial gain. Whether you qualify a remark with a smarmy tongue in cheek comment is irrelevant , you made it - now stand by it , tell us who in your opinion is unhappy about not getting a few paltry $ for their contributions.
IMHO you are a leecher - what exactly have you contributed here - sheesh - talk about living in cloud cuckoo land.

The comments about penalties was another tongue in cheek comment. I guess I need to remember that comment I find to be humorous are not always taken as such by others. If you knew me and the volunteer work that I do in political circles, you would have no doubt in your mind about my opinions on censorship. One thing I like about this forum is our ability to speak our minds.
As for the three in a row. I was reading up on this particular thread and as one struck a nerve, I responded to it. I guess no one wrote anything between the times that I posted, so they all showed up together like that. Kind of shocked me as well.
Now, not to hash over old posts, but if you would like I could go back and give cut and paste quotes from two individuals in particular who not only were speaking their minds, but doing it in a way that could be seen by quite a few in this forum as plain arrogant and rude. My posts were not blatant comments about people in here who have a problem with the changes, but to those in particular who were making free plugs for new web forums without asking permission to do so. A new group started is fine, but to do it solely out of spite is another. There were also a few comments made that gave the impression (at least by one person) that this forum would really suffer if they were not around to give their two cents worth. This entire forum is a place of learning and sharing for all of us. No one person in here is going to make or break this forum (except for David if he just gets tired of all the drama and shuts it down- of Course).
And in the area of launching my business. I have a degree in visual communications, I have worked in the signs industry for years and have been on my own for years. The engraving part of the business is new. I know business, I also know professionalism and the way A FEW of the posts were made wasn't (to borrow your analogy)a family sitting around the dinner table, but rather a family sitting around a dinner table with one member of the family over in the corner throwing a fit because he/she has to eat what is served them (i.e. a free site moving to a paid site by the guy who created the site).
By all means, lets discuss, but lets also do it professionally. Knowing that the site is going to go this direction and that if it is that much of an issue, we have the right to go to one of the other sites or start one ourselves. David has my full support on this move.